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#1 Jean_Manco

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 12:43 PM

http://www.ukwizz.com/ - a new SE for the home crowd.

#2 ac

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 12:51 PM

So Jean, the UK is getting their one-a-day new search engine dose like we are in the states?

:) :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

#3 UKWizz

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 04:32 PM

Hi there.
Just a quick introduction. My name is Alistair McIntyre and Im the guy behind UKwizz.

Thanks for spotting it and posting about it. I actualy found this post doing a link check on Google. :D

Just now UKWizz is still being worked on. I'm trying to get everything working as well as posible, then I plan to try and promote it as much as possible. It's pretty difficult because I run the whole thing from a walk in cupboard at my house on pretty much a zero budget.

The aim is to keep it as UK specific as possible. Google, yahoo and the others are great search engines, I just feel they let the average UK searcher down.

Feel free to let me know what you think :lol: (be gentle) lol

#4 ac

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 05:00 PM

Brilliant, I ran a search on it today and it returned only UK results for a search that turns in 800 or so on the big engines.

I got 2 results, both results were from the UK.

So it looks like you are on your way, are you going to give us your trade secrets?

Are you using API's from other engines like some of the other Meta Search Engines?

Will you make deals with data providers like IBM who provides data services for small retail Search Engines?

Are you open source like www.nutch.org

We have millions of questions for you, I will list you on my International Search Engines page, see the link in my signature.

I will list you if you are kind to all of us and give us some information.

Not asking for your trade secrets, but I am sure a lot of folks here would be interested in General Information from a search engine builder/developer?

#5 Grumpus

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 05:05 PM

Most of the answers to those questions are here, AC.

G.

#6 ac

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 05:08 PM

Looks like a great program G, thanks for the link.

#7 UKWizz

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 06:42 PM

Thanks again guys,

Quite a fast moving forum you have here.

A lot of people have asked me "is it a feed etc" honestly, it isn't. I woudl have probably been a lot cheaper to use one though :shock:

The biggest batttle I have is with keeping it UK specific. When I forst had the idea to lunch a UK se I know I had to find some method of filtering results. The easy option is to only index .co.uk domain names, but them you are loosing a lot of good UK sites on .com .net etc. What I decided was to block a lot of comain extensions, the ones that are not going to be UK relates such as most european extensions. Then allow .com .net .org etc but filter url's by ip address. That way I exclude anything that doesnt reside on a Uk ip range.

At first I though it woudl be simly a case of downloading a cvs file and using it.. no chance. I ended up downloading a world IP database and removing everything but UK. Took ages lol. The main problem I have it that IP ranges are not constaint. Every now and them I need to re-do the Ip ranges to make sure I am up to date.

But hey all's fun in the world of "web"

#8 ac

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 07:27 PM

Yes, but I have seen other UKengines that include results from outside the UK, are you going to offer an option to your search users for the rest of the world so they do not leave your site?

We hope you remain a member here for a long time, like I mentioned, we will have over a million questions to ask you in the future. Be sure to come back 5 times a day please...... :?:

#9 Jean_Manco

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 03:08 AM

I can assure any sceptics that UK Wizz really, really has its own spider. I know because it's been busily indexing my site. :)

I think we will see a lot more of this type of SE. The Internet is now so vast. Who needs thousands of results for a query? What people want is relevant results. And a lot of the time that includes a geographical limit.

One of the big attractions of Google for me has been the option on Google.co.uk to search UK sites only. It's pretty effective. (And of course Google offers similiar options for other countries and for languages.) But there's room for good competition.

UK Wizz at the moment carries no advertising. That's a plus.

BBC Search also carries no advertising. That uses a Yahoo/Intomi database I believe, but with a filter that favours UK sites. There's been recent talk from the BBC of making its search a stand-alone service. Some commentators interpreted that as meaning that Auntie would dump Yahoo and build its own SE. From where I'm sitting it looks more as though the intention is to move search to its own domain. But would they be interested in dropping Yahoo in favour of a home-grown SE I wonder ....

#10 UKWizz

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 03:13 AM

"Jean_Manco" excelent. In that case can I ask you a few questions :)

Just the generals. Did it behave, did it respect your robots.txt and did it take it's time to index?

UKWizz.

#11 Jean_Manco

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 03:46 AM

Sorry - I didn't pay close attention to your spider's manners. I wouldn't worry though. Complaints will come your way fast enough, if people find anything to complain about. :wink:

#12 UKWizz

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 06:46 AM

Complaints will come your way fast enough, if people find anything to complain about


haha Yea, you better beleive it.

UKWizz

#13 behindTheScenes

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 10:30 AM

Just a quick one UKWhizz, when I type in a url I expect the engine to tell me if that URL is listed, like google etc does, yours just goes ahead and performs a search on it.

#14 ac

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 11:31 AM

UKWhizz, now you are being grilled by the membership good, just like you expected, can you review this thread and give responses to the questions in my posts?

#15 MrCrip

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 01:00 PM

Awesome, most of my top key phrases are well placed, I like it, carry on!!

Good find Jean

#16 UKWizz

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 02:59 PM

Just a quick one UKWhizz, when I type in a url I expect the engine to tell me if that URL is listed, like google etc does, yours just goes ahead and performs a search on it.


Thats a very good point. I have always been amazed at how many people can't see the difference between a search box and an address bar. I will try and impliment that asap.

AC you where asking about perhaps adding an option where users can search the rest of the web. I have been giving this a lot of though. To be honest I am aiming the SE mainly at UK users so in effect it creates a niche. Although I have to agree that sometimes you do need a backup. A good example woudl be a universal search. (looking for some code etc) when doing this sort of search country specific means nothing. I think I will find a way of adding a web search option, perhaps have it as a link on the "no results found" page or from within the serps.
If I do add a web search option I woudl liek to offer search from a new se like mines, as oposed to simply using a feed from Google etc.

You also asked about the software I use. I vurrently Run aspseek. It's written in c++ and runs well on linux. The downside is that aspseek is very much at the end of it's development. I have a wish list and a c++ developer who I used to go to school with :?

UKWizz

#17 MrCrip

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 03:11 PM

It would be nice to know how you plan to convert the masses to use your engine?

#18 UKWizz

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 03:33 PM

Well that will for sure be the hard part. All I can do is try to offer a good search experience. All I offer is pure web results, no ads, no bannrs no sponsored listing etc. I hope that will encourage people to use it.

UKWizz

#19 bwelford

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 03:46 PM

Congratulations, UKWizz, I'm sure you have a great market waiting for you. I like the clean lines of your site.

One small irritant is that I note your SERP pages give a horizontal scroll bar even at 1024 x 768 resolution. This is because of the size of some of your images. I would suggest a maximum width of 744 pixels so that even Mac users on 800 x 600 resolution can see it all.

As an ex-Brit here in Canada, I did not expect to find any references to me and I didn't. :) However I hoped that you might have a link to my brother's website for Creative Learning called BrainWareMap. Have you considered adding a 'Submit a link' feature?

#20 UKWizz

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Posted 25 August 2004 - 05:18 PM

hi bwelford,

I have also noticed the faults on the pages. I will be moving towards a fluid layout very soon. The design right now is really more of a shell until I get the back-end sorted out. Once everything else is working well I will launch a new design.

I will also be including an add url form soon also. What I want to do Is have one good index that has been purely spidered before I allow submited pages. That way if things go wrong it is possible to roll back.

This is a great place for getting feedback, thanks guys/gals :D

UKWizz

#21 MrCrip

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Posted 26 August 2004 - 05:02 AM

Hi, using the engine again this morning, I found it slightly irritating that there was no 'next/previous' option to navigate through the search results.

Is this something that you guys have considered?

#22 UKWizz

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Posted 26 August 2004 - 10:58 AM

HI MrCrip.

You you where right.. next and prev buttons now in use :D

UKWizz.

#23 MrCrip

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Posted 26 August 2004 - 11:36 AM

Put my consultancy fee in your algo for my sites!!

#24 ac

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Posted 26 August 2004 - 06:36 PM

UKWizz, let say an American company had a mirror site for the UK, served in the UK, that would mean those sites would qualify to be in your index, yes?

#25 UKWizz

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Posted 27 August 2004 - 04:47 AM

Hi ac,

Yep any site hosted on a UKip range is able to be listed.

UKWizz.

#26 ac

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 01:27 PM

UKWizz you know about these other guys in your market.

www.infouno.com

They just came out with Meta search for UK

#27 UKWizz

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 05:40 PM

Yep infouno is looking pretty good. One of the few metas that actualy address the UK specific issue.

The main problem with a meta is lack of control over the results, although in this case they have a pretty good balence from each engine.

UKWizz.

#28 ac

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 08:21 PM

Why not find out if they have venture capital behind them and give them 20% of your company for a few million?

#29 bragadocchio

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 08:51 PM

That's a difficult choice to make, ac.

I saw a college student's white paper recently on the creation and valuation of a company, and his first question jumped right into developing the business to please a venture capitalist. I'm not sure most people start with that in mind.

I'd guess that most companies don't start out looking to be a publically traded company. I'd also say that the process of becoming one has a tendency to transform a company into something very different that what its creator started.

I'd imagine, that if Alistair is running UKWizz from a small office, he might be tempted if he got an offer like that. :)

But, he seems to have a pretty good business plan, a niche that he seems to have cornered, a smart approach, and the good sense to visit with us and ask and answer questions. (Thanks UKWizz!) It' would probably be tempting to stick it out in a situation like that. 10%? Maybe?

Didn't two univerisity students make a deal early on to bring their internet company public? Yep. The two guys from Yahoo! What were their names again?

#30 ac

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 09:23 PM

Brag, getting venture capital does not mean that you must go public, the costs of legal, accounting and reporting requirements for a small company are upwards of $500,000 - $1,000,000 a year just to comply with the SEC regulations to become and remain publicly traded.

Staying private is the way to go until you are forced to go public. Google was forced to go public because of the number of shareholders. In addition to that, the venture capital folks and the early investors want to cash out.

Going public offers many opportunities, but has many associated expenses for legal, public relations and disclosure requirements.

I would never tell any small company to even consider it, a lot of small companies are going private because of the above mentioned costs to remain public.

#31 sanity

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 09:27 PM

Welcome to Cre8 UKWizz! :wave:

Feel free to post your search engine in your signature file.

#32 bragadocchio

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 09:50 PM

I don't think I offered UKWizz a welcome to the forums either,

Good to have you aboard UKWizz!


... the costs of legal, accounting and reporting requirements for a small company are upwards of $500,000 - $1,000,000 a year just to comply with the SEC regulations to become and remain publicly traded.


I remember being surprised a few years back when I learned that it wasn't unusual for the process of having an Initial Public Offering to cost over a million dollars.

There are even more compliance and reporting requirements these days than ever before. It is expensive.

I'd agree that staying private is an ideal situation for many companies, and the number of private companies in the US and around the world dwarfs the number of companies where shares are exchanged on a stock market.

But there are times when opportunity costs need to be met, and an IPO is the only way to secure the type of money necessary to take advantage of those opportunities.

Funny though, the most common exit from a company by a venture capitalist is through a merger or acquisition rather than an IPO.

I'd recommend avoiding the venture capitalists if possible, for as long as possible, unless it makes sense to have the money to help grow.

#33 ac

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 10:00 PM

I have a group of VC's wanting me to give them a road show right now, they have called me a few times. The bottom line is this, if you do not have operating capital you must do a private placement of shares to get the money needed to grow the business. What is an opportunity today, may not be in 2 years.

Lets put it this way, if they offer me 2 million for 20% of my business they would have their 20% as soon as the corporate attorney had the holding company incorporated and the shares can be distributed.

#34 Respree

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 10:03 PM

Far more expensive to go public than to stay public, although that's expensive too.

The typical lead underwriting fees are 5 to 7 percent. $100 million IPO, well the math is pretty easy.

Add to that recurring auditors, SEC counsel, internal accounting and legal fees, filing fees, annual report costs, Sabanes-Oxley compliance, annual meeting costs, public relations fees, board of director fees, stock option administration, crisis-management firms, press releases, conference calls and you've got one big administrative pain in the behind. It's very expensive.

#35 ac

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 10:05 PM

Amen, Respree, you got it exactly right.

#36 bragadocchio

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 10:08 PM

Good points.

I'm not sure if it's fair of us to be selling off the business without the involvement of UKWizz. :)

I guess we're sort of wandering widely off the topic.

A strong niche search engine based upon geography is a great idea though.

#37 kckc

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Posted 30 August 2004 - 10:53 PM

UK Wizz, looks pretty nice. I like how you can see the number of hits within a particular site, and click straight into them.

#38 UKWizz

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Posted 31 August 2004 - 09:27 AM

Hi again guys,

VC funding would be a dream come true, the way it works just now is I have a day job (non IT related) and that finances the se. So far I have been able to keep the costs really low. I build my own servers, host from home etc. Curently it's all about keeping the costs as low as possible. I do however plan to grow, as this happens the costs will inevitably go up.

In terms of generating revenue, I dont want to do this directly from the ukwizz sites. On UKwizz i don't have any plans to use advertising ect. To be honest my main ain is to build a decent index that I can liscence to other sites. I know that if i want to do this the results will need to be improved, but as the index grows I am working on this.

What I want to offer is a totaly "pure" search engine. No ads, no ppc and no sponsored links. The most I would do, would be to have a small "powered by" image on the homepage, that is if anyone would actualy want to be a sponsor.

If I was to get any form of funding I think I would have no trouble spending it. Lets just say I have quite a large shopping list as it is. The main areas are load balencing and more bandwidth, so I guess I will be putting in a lot of overtime :shock:

UKWIzz

#39 ac

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Posted 31 August 2004 - 09:46 AM

I am sure the VC's will be contacting you, but your first move should be retaining a very good corporate attorney before signing anything with anyone.

You might want to contact a few bankers in London before jumping in when looking for a law firm.

#40 Jean_Manco

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Posted 31 August 2004 - 10:07 AM

Alistair - Did you see my hint that the BBC might be in the market for a feed from a home-grown SE with a UK focus?



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