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Tip: Getting the budget out of a client


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#1 sanity

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 03:16 PM

Truth is, everyone has a number in their head. They have a good idea of what they can spend or they wouldn’t be shopping in public. If they don’t then they shouldn’t be asking you to invest your time in writing a proposal — and you most certainly shouldn’t provide them with one.


As most of us know when a potential clients asks "how much for a website" it's like asking "how long is a piece of string". I long ago learned the value of asking for an idea of their budget up front - which is not always greeted well.

Here's some tips to get the budget out of a potential client:

http://www.37signals...ives/000974.php

#2 ukdaz

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 03:19 PM

Thanks for that tip!

I'm definitely going to keep that one up my sleeve the next time I have to pitch to a client.

;)

Daz

#3 Respree

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 03:41 PM

I think most clients can appreciate that you don't want to waste their time and vice versa. If they're hesitant to disclose a budget, you could tactfully ask "Just so that we don't waste each other's time, is your budget more like $500 or $5,000?" I'm pretty sure they'll know which it is closer to.

#4 thirstymoose_2000

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 03:47 PM

My opinion is that if a client won't give you a number they are not very serious --- walk away. They are not acting in a professional manner. I have a very low conversion rate on these types of inquiries so I no longer bother with them.

The one exception might be if they do have a farily detailed outline of what they are looking for and sincerely say that they have no idea how much this type of work costs. The work they've invested qualifies them as being fairly serious.

Normally if you really push they will have some sort of ceiling.

The secret I have found that you explain it is better for both parties to work with some sort of number because it saves time for both parties and the designer can give much better recommendations and suggestions.

I remember doing one that I gave the person three different price points because they didn't have a budget (it was a hospital so I went a head and did it). I gave them a good-better-best scenario which they appretiated. But it normally isn't worth that much effort for the ROI.

#5 Adrian

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 04:11 PM

My opinion is that if a client won't give you a number they are not very serious --- walk away. They are not acting in a professional manner.


The fairly technical director of the company I work for would hate giving budgets. he'd have an idea in his head about what sort of ceiling there is, but I'm pretty sure he'd refuse to say it, because he'd then expect the company to quote to the budget, rather than quote for the work. And by that, he'd expect to be overcharged.....

He wants to know how much something will cost to do, not tell someone doing a quote what to aim at. If that cost is well above what he's prepared to do, then he'll start looking at compromising features/fnctionality of whatever it is, and whether it's still worth doing.

Though saying that, in some respects he's probably a better 'client' than most, as he's is fairly technically minded and has an idea about whats going on. I can imagine that many are a pain, but for some, its just that they are too used to being screwed over by annoying customers.

#6 Tim

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 04:47 PM

he'd have an idea in his head about what sort of ceiling there is, but I'm pretty sure he'd refuse to say it, because he'd then expect the company to quote to the budget, rather than quote for the work. And by that, he'd expect to be overcharged.....

That's exactly what I'd think if I was in a client's shoes, so that's what I assume my clients would think as well. I have a Website Strategy Planner, basically a 12 page document that I send out to all new clients that asks many questions about what they want to achieve, etc., and one of the questions asks about their budget. Not one client has given me a dollar figure, ever. Most leave it blank, other's write things like "we have limited funds".

It's a good tip though.

However, I'd then be worried that a client might ask me "Why do you want to know my budget? Are you going to overcharge me?" What would you answser to that? Would you actually increase your quote if the budget was higher?

#7 sanity

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 05:29 PM

However, I'd then be worried that a client might ask me "Why do you want to know my budget? Are you going to overcharge me?" What would you answser to that? Would you actually increase your quote if the budget was higher?

I can appreciate that the prospect might think this but then on the other hand as two professionals who are looking at getting into a business relationship you'd like to start off with more trust. :)

As much as a prospect may worry that if they give you their budget you might quote up to that what about the others who are prepared to spend? If you don't have an idea of their budget how do you know you're giving them the best solution. Works both ways.

Put it this way you don't go to an architect and say draw me up some plans for a house and not tell them how much you're prepared to pay to build it.

#8 DCrx

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 06:07 PM

This is an intriguing issue, mostly with price only playing a supporting role? The question also feeds into recent news, with Best Buy as poster boy for how not to do it.

However, since we are quoting 37sigs, this may be an interesting addition...

[list]$150/hr Standard Rate 
$200/hr if you want it NOW 
$250/hr if you want to watch over my shoulder while I work 
$300/hr if you want to help 
$400/hr if you worked on it first 
[list]
-- All hours are not created equal


Should price be "context aware" to use a neutral term? ....Charge double for table based layouts? Charge the same for clients who create problems? How about a “I don't know what I want, but I know what I don’t like" fee?

#9 Adrian

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 06:08 PM

I don't know, I think generally I'd tell the architect what kind of house I wanted, then ask him how much it would cost, not tell him how much I want to spend, and then find out what I can get for it.....

If a potential client asks for something that they then find is way out of their budget, they then have to re-evaluate what they want.

Ok, if they have no idea what they actually want, then there's a problem. But I can't see that having an idea of a budget, and no idea of what is wanted actually helps much anyway.

Yes I think at some point you need to know how much they are willing to spend, especially if an initial quote is above it, and you need to work out what options there are of bringing it within that budget.

#10 Paul_H

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 06:41 PM

A friend of mine who worked in sales for insurance companies, and various high tech companies such as IBM, says the biggest mistake rookie sales people make is to quote a price before knowing the clients budget.

He said he’s gone round in circles many a time repeatedly asking what the clients budget is only to be met with “how much will it cost”, but he never cracks – not sure I would have that much will power.

#11 kensplace

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 08:35 PM

Find out what is required, offer price to do the work.

If you are going by how much money client has, then you are a rip off merchant. Charge how much it costs.

If they dont like your figures, find someone who does.
If no one does - your crap at your figures - or your abilities.

#12 sanity

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Posted 13 December 2004 - 09:32 PM

Ken I think you're kinda missing the point. :)

It's certainly not about ripping someone off. It all comes down to using the client's budget to provide the best strategy. A budget will help you determine how big/small/complex/not complex a site is. If it requires eCommerce will an open source system be suitable or do they want a completely customised solution. Will they want an online ordering system that is processed online or on their budget would they rather just collect card numbers and process offline. Does it extend to organic optimisation, PPC campaigns etc, etc.

Having an idea of a client's budget means you can provide them with the best possible solution to fit that budget.

#13 DianeV

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Posted 14 December 2004 - 06:14 AM

And there's the corollary to what Sophie has said: if you don't know the client's budget, the client needs to know what range the fee will likely fall into. Otherwise, your time and his/hers may be being wasted.

#14 Paul_H

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Posted 14 December 2004 - 06:31 AM

Find out what is required, offer price to do the work.


Knowing their budget makes a huge difference to what you offer and what you talk about in the information gathering phase. Most clients, are not 100% sure what they want and have no idea how much things cost. If you keep mentioning features and options they would like be can’t afford you are going to lose the client.

Imagine a client asks for shopping cart, you starting chatting to them without asking what their budget is. You ask what features they would like but they aren’t sure, so you mention custom design, telephone support, optimised, dedicated hosting etc. They think that all sounds good and are happy so far. So you also mention you can provide an offline application to mange the site, which will also integrate with their stock control software, and generate invoices. Now they are really impressed and want this too. So you prepare a quote, £10-£15k. The client receives the quote and never speaks to you again. They think you’re trying to rip them off. Turns out they had no idea how much dedicated hosting, a custom design and an offline application would cost and they only had a budget of £1000. If you knew their budget from the beginning you could of kept the talk to things they could

#15 thirstymoose_2000

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Posted 14 December 2004 - 11:11 AM

I don't know, I think generally I'd tell the architect what kind of house I wanted, then ask him how much it would cost, not tell him how much I want to spend, and then find out what I can get for it.....


You have it backwards. In my previous 'analogue life' I sold home building packages for about five years. The first question you ask is how 'much money do you want to spend'. Are you seriously going to pay an architect several thousand dollars to design a house that you can't possibly afford to build? Because unlike the norm in our industry, an architect will charge for EVERYTHING.

In our case, should we spend hours of our time developing a proposal based on what clients say they want just to find they can't afford it or don't have a budget for it? If a client won't give you a budget will they cover your cost of developing this porposal as an architect would be payed for developing the blueprint for a house?

I have been very successful dealing with clients by asking how much they are thinking of spending and then working with them to prioritize/decide what they can get for that price. It's my experience that what people want and what they have a budget for are two seperate things.

Don't get me wrong, the client can give you a brief scope of work to give you an idea and we can quickly ballpark them. I'm speaking of actual esimates. It is not in your best interest to go far into that process until you have a budget.

Why are people so afraid of asking for a budget? Trust me, clients know you're going to have to ask. :)

Ever buy a car? What was the first criteria in your decision making process? Price. You look at your price range and then look at cars withing that price.

As mentioned above there is no use talking to a client about features like shopping carts and CMS when they can't possibly afford it.

And Ken, your strategy would not give a very good return as you hand in a price based on what the client says they want without working on the best strategy WITH them. I get a far higher conversion rate when I design a strategy based on the clients' budget.

To be honest, it's somewhat insulting that you suggest we are 'rip off artists'.


Sanity, Diane, Paul bang-on!

#16 gravelsack

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Posted 14 December 2004 - 01:13 PM

My opinion is that if a client won't give you a number they are not very serious --- walk away


That is seriously bad advice.

Many professionally trained negotiators will decline to give you a number - the game (for both sides), as they see it, is to get the other to give the figures first.

#17 thirstymoose_2000

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Posted 15 December 2004 - 12:30 PM

But the figures for what? How can you possibly develop a strategy for building a web site without knowing a budget?

I guess it all depends on how you work with your clients. I can understand if you're negotiating the purchase of 20 computers with XXX chipset, CD-RW burners, XXX RAM and XX hard drive. Then yeah, you negotiate a price.

But in terms of developing a strategy for a web site, two of the most important factors are budget and deadline. How can you possibly quote a price of $20,000 when you don't even know what you're building or how long you have to build it?

I guess if you work based on clients providing a full set of specs you could price in this manner, but in most cases I consult with the clients to get to that point.

#18 gravelsack

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Posted 15 December 2004 - 02:17 PM

A professional company with competent purchasing staff will give you an invitation to quote which details full specifications and deadline.

Sure - there may be some discussion over the exact specifications, and your quotation would need a comment covering any post-quote spec changes.

My point is that this quote:

My opinion is that if a client won't give you a number they are not very serious --- walk away

... is incorrect when dealing with truly professional companies. Few as they are, they tend to be the big hitters financially. Not the ones to walk away from IMO.

#19 Adrian

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Posted 15 December 2004 - 02:47 PM

If you're working with someone who has absolutely no idea what they want, then yeah, if you're going to get anywhere, you're going to need something to work on.

I imagine they are also some of the worst clients to work for though.

Going back to the architect thing. If you want to build a house, you generally have some idea of the number of bedrooms etc you want.

If a potential client doesn't know whether they want a full online shopping sysem, or a poster style website, then yeah, perhaps a guide of what they want to spend can help you let them know what they can have. I think I would be quite worried about those kind of clients though.

#20 gravelsack

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Posted 15 December 2004 - 03:06 PM

I think I would be quite worried about those kind of clients though.


Agreed - when a client doesn't really know what he wants, its a problem.

Its also an opportunity to establish trust and authority.

If you can talk him through 'what he can have' and specifically the ROI stuff, how you can track it and how you are NOT going to encourage him to spend money where there is no ROI.

If they 'get it', and you do the job properly, they become clients for life.

If they don't 'get it', thats the cue to walk.

#21 peter_d

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Posted 15 December 2004 - 05:20 PM

Agree with Gravelsack - the good negotiators get the other guy to show his hand first. It is the stronger position because many people find it difficult to open the haggle - it causes them stress. If the seller is a little underconfident, then they may open with a low price, which is to the buyers advantage.

#22 DCrx

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Posted 15 December 2004 - 08:29 PM

A way to get around this impasse is with a neutral prescreen question which does not trigger the "whoever mentions price first loses" behavior. This would be like, "Do you have a budget already set and fully funded for this project?"

What this does is give you some options to find out 1) What level of authority the person you are talking to has. 2) What level of urgency there is.

And occasionally it could be you will never be a serious contender for the job, the buyer might be trying to fish out a low bid as leverage against a favored vendor. Price is rarely being negotiated, rather the relationship and authority relationship of seller to buyer. A lowball bidder may find the perception of their authority to recommend changes or one approach over another is limited later on.

P.S. For those who geek on the whole issue, it's the basis of game theory.

#23 Tangaroa

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 05:37 AM

In our case, should we spend hours of our time developing a proposal based on what clients say they want just to find they can't afford it or don't have a budget for it? If a client won't give you a budget will they cover your cost of developing this porposal as an architect would be payed for developing the blueprint for a house?


In that case you should always inform the client that there is a cost involved for developing the proposal and you can even ask for a deposit on the proposal. This way there aren't any surprises for the client and youself.

I'm having another question regarding the invoicing of the client. Do you handle different rates for example lay-out (design, graphical work, etc), content writing and dynamic pages (PHP, ASP, etc.)?

Also when I see the prices that are being asked by semi-professionals and I look at the prices I ask my client, I'm getting the feeling I'm not asking enough. Is there like a minimum I can ask for development?

#24 Tangaroa

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 05:45 AM

Tim

I have a Website Strategy Planner, basically a 12 page document that I send out to all new clients that asks many questions about what they want to achieve, etc., and one of the questions asks about their budget.


Is this a private or a public document you are using? :wink:

#25 James

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 06:05 AM

I'm imagining that it's private. However, you could always ask Tim for a website! ;-)

We live in a world where the same website will be priced by different companies at wildly different prices. The client may well have been quoted a 10th of the price you have in mind by a family member who does web design for a living. In my experience, it's good to get a price up front, but clients are unwilling, more often than not, to divulge a figure. Therefore, you need to quote based on the knowledge that you have of their requirements and justify the price based on the value-added proposition you are making. If you are confident in your abilities, and can explain why the client will get a much better site for $2000 rather than $200, you shouldn't be frightened to stick with your prices.

I see no harm in meeting a potential client and running through their requirements, give them an idea of the pitfalls they should avoid, and how to best choose the site's features, what aspects of the web design are most important, etc, etc. This one-on-one session will help prove that you actually know what you're talking about, help them make some choices about what they really want and gets a foot in the door. Then, by producing a proposal (assuming they give the go-ahead), you are effectively providing the client with some valuable information that they can then use to make an informed decision. I see no problem in charging for this invaluable advice. If the client chooses not to pay for the advice, they probably wouldn't have paid enough for the web development.

If the client does go to the $200 webdesigner, they will have been educated as to some of the the things that they could have for the money. When the $200 web designer realises that the scope of the project is outside their abilities based on the time allocated to the project, the client may well come back and pay the higher figure.

#26 Tim

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 06:28 AM

Is this a private or a public document you are using? ;)

Well, as James said, you could always ask me to develop a site for you, and I'd then more than likely send you a copy of the document to fill out. :wink:

If you'd like to see it, PM me and I'll send you a copy. It's copyright of course, but you're more than welcome to use it to get ideas.

Recently though, I've had some bad feedback about it, so while I'm away this Christmas without all the busy-ness of work, I'll be rethinking the strategies of it. So you may want to ask for a copy when I've redone it, considering the bad feedback of the current one. :P

#27 James

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 06:30 AM

Or you could see it as an opportunity to get comments to help improve it?

#28 Tim

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 06:39 AM

Fantastic idea, thanks James! Ok, that's the condition of me giving anyone a copy. :wink:

#29 James

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 06:57 AM

Ha, yes, wise move there Tim! :-)

#30 bwelford

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 09:03 AM

Perhaps part of the problem here is that the client may not realize that there are apples and oranges ... and lemons as far as web designers go. The client must compare like with like. If you as a web designer are an apple, then you don't want to get into a situation where the client is comparing you with a lemon and finding your price high.

Perhaps you can get the client to see that he or she should only be looking at the apples in making a choice. It seems to me that a short list of questions could help the client to do this. I would say to the client that they should make sure that they will get a clear 'Yes' answer to the following four questions from the web designers they wish to consider:
- Will you ensure that my website will function well on the common browsers such as Internet Explorer and Firefox?
- Will you ensure that my website will be search-engine friendly while following the Terms of Service of the major search engines?
- Will you ensure that the website architecture and content will give high selling effectiveness?
- Will you ensure that the website is launched on-time and within budget?

If the client will not undertake to deal only with web designers that can answer Yes to all these four questions, then you should gracefully decline to quote.

Do you agree with this approach? Would you suggest different questions?

#31 thirstymoose_2000

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 11:13 AM

My opinion is that if a client won't give you a number they are not very serious --- walk away 

... is incorrect when dealing with truly professional companies. Few as they are, they tend to be the big hitters financially. Not the ones to walk away from IMO.


Well, that's a matter of your opinion. You may be correct when dealing with a commodity product or service, but generally when I work on a project, I am the one who designs the specifications for that project.

I have done work for private sector companies, Government departments (all three levels) as well as public institutions and have never had any of my clients refuse to give me a number to work with. Most will at least give you a range.

Again, if a company is purchasing cleaning for their building or you are looking for someone to assemble X number of widgets to a certain set of specs, thats one thing. In our biz that might be someone hired to simply code a bunch of pages or convert a bunch of documents to HTML.

As I said, I guess it all depends on how one works. Generally in professional design (it was the same when I used to work in Advertising) there is a short list, followed by a capabilities review (affectionately known as the 'dog and pony show'). Once you've passed this phase you talk higher level budget and dollar figures.

Normally, companies don't have the expertise in-house, which is why we are being called in. On some projects you might be called in a given a set of specifications "We want a site with a shopping cart that will process orders, a CMS product cataloge and about ten pages used to market ourselves." At some point working on this quote the question of budget has to come-up if you want to find the proper solution for this company. Do you custom build a back-end or use some sort of enterprise software? Is a third-party hosted solution better for the client?

Even when I was in advertising and acting as a client, I always gave my venders (media sales people) a budget to work with. Where it might be reversed is essentially commodity items like printing where you had a set of specs like 5000 copies on X stock of paper with x colours.

The better question for your argument is are you a commodity or a unique capable solutions provider? How do your clients perceive you?

I guess neither is 'right' or 'wrong' it is opinion based on our own experience.

Mine is that there is a very low conversion rate for simply submitting proposals based on specs and numbers while I have an extremely high conversion rate going through a capabilites process and then developing a unique solution based on a client's budget. As I only have a limited amount of time, it is not worth it for me to chase low conversion leads.



Going back to the architect thing. If you want to build a house, you generally have some idea of the number of bedrooms etc you want.

No ethical or competant architect is going to design a house based on that. Can you afford three bedrooms? I challenge you to talk to any real estate agent or walk into any architect or builder's office --- the very first question will be about your budget. Then they try to find a solution within that budget. Otherwise it is just a waste of everyone's time.

#32 peter_d

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Posted 16 December 2004 - 03:53 PM

One of the reasons they ask budget is that it is a negotiating ploy. All salespeople want that information because once they have it, the salesperson will then attempt to sell you something at the top of that range. Above that range, if they're smart.

Do you publish your prices on your site? If not, why not? :D

There's no such thing as a fixed price.

Car salesmen ask me what I want to spend. I always tell them "I want to spend no more than I need to". I then outline the specsifications. They'll get a feel for the range soon enough based on the specs, but they still don't know exactly how much I've got in my pocket. So they treat me very well indeed, and when I go into negotaition they are unlikely to negotiate at a price that is, mysteriously, right at the top end of my budget. The sticker price is merely an indication. Whoever pays that price? I bet they hope some people do. The price is set by the market. Something is worth exactly what I'm prepared to pay for it, and the seller is prepared to take for it.

As a seller, I always try and get the figure as soon as possible. As a buyer, I seldom let go of it early. I understand why the seller wants this figure. But I also understand why the buyer may not want to give it. I think you can get a feel for the range if you listen and ask the right questions regarding specification. And then be confident of your services. Repackage the deal if they haggle on price. Walk away if it the deal doesn't suit you.

I think the exception is if there is already an established trust relationship based on previous dealings.

#33 Adrian

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Posted 17 December 2004 - 10:50 AM

One of the reasons they ask budget is that it is a negotiating ploy. All salespeople want that information because once they have it, the salesperson will then attempt to sell you something at the top of that range. Above that range, if they're smart.


Exactly!

I challenge you to talk to any real estate agent or walk into any architect or builder's office --- the very first question will be about your budget.


With a view to getting you to do exactly what Peter's just said. They don't want you to spend £120,000 if you can afford and are willing to pay £200,000.

If you do a proposal for a client that has given you a budget, is the cost of the work you do ever very different from that budget?

I really can't see that it's very good business to go to any kind of service provider and say I've got £x, what can you do for me.

Even if I went to someone like that without a clue as to what I wanted, I'd want to know some different options, with very rough ball park figures for cost, and information on how much it's going to benefit us.

Option A maybe £x, Option B £2x, option C £3x.
And it may be that Option C in within our budget, but that Option B will give us better ROI.

Why spend right up to the top of our budget in that case?

#34 thirstymoose_2000

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Posted 17 December 2004 - 10:53 AM

But there is that sticker on the car that allows you (a consumer) to use as your first filter --- what cars do you look at and then negotiate? This works for commodity items.

How does one do this for a web development job?

As I mentioned, as designers we should be the people who design specifications for a project. Two of the most important criteria when developing this plan is budget and time.

#35 Adrian

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Posted 17 December 2004 - 11:13 AM

Another of the most important criteria is ROI.

#36 cline

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Posted 17 December 2004 - 04:14 PM

I spent most of my career on client side and I always resented salespeople who pushed early or hard for a budget figure. The harder they pushed, the more I backed away.

Of course, as a seller, the budget figure is hugely valuable in qualifying the prospect and tailoring a solution, it's also valuable in figuring out how much revenue you can squeeze out of the client.

Now that I'm on the sell side, in talking to prospects I try to explore what solving their problems is worth, then on my own calculate how much they should budget for it. If you can get the client to see what the opportunity is, the budget can be changed.

I also try to break the project down into chunks and recommend one of them as the lowest honing fruit. This give us a lower commitment path to start a business relationship and an opportunity for the client to gauge the value they're receiving.

#37 thirstymoose_2000

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Posted 19 December 2004 - 12:03 AM

Another of the most important criteria is ROI.

But you need to know what investment the client wants a return on. ;)

#38 gravelsack

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Posted 19 December 2004 - 02:24 PM

Mine is that there is a very low conversion rate for simply submitting proposals based on specs and numbers while I have an extremely high conversion rate going through a capabilites process and then developing a unique solution based on a client's budget.


Am we to assume that you have never quoted for a client that has professional purchasing staff?

All qualified purchasing professionals will seek a number of quotations, giving all suppliers the same information and specifications.

#39 cline

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Posted 19 December 2004 - 09:32 PM

All qualified purchasing professionals will seek a number of quotations, giving all suppliers the same information and specifications.


I find that prospective clients who have set ideas of what they want executed are much less likely to convert than ones who have general ideas of what they want to achieve and are looking for help figuring out how to do it.

Sometimes the difference is subtle, but significant. For example, a prospective SEO client who knows exactly what term they want to optimize on is less likely to convert than an otherwise identical prospect who wants me to help them figure out what to optimize on.

Of course, I sell consulting. It may be different for folks who emphasize more hands-on tasks.

#40 The Alien

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Posted 19 December 2004 - 11:30 PM

I tend to give clients a low ballpark say 1k to 4k and a high ballpark say 10k to 80k we come to somewhere in the middle as to what they want and the budget is.

I just tell them I need to know what they want to accomplish then I can give them a ballpark figure if it's in their range we go for it, if not we talk and see what they can do without and what they must have to come to a figure. No wish list is involved, they seem to be a waste of time for me and I let the client know this.

The most important question is what do you want to accomplish with the site. With this I can give them ballpark numbers low end and high end. This gives me a general idea of the budget without being blunt or pushy. There is a time when the client will tell me that they have X amount of $'s to spend on the project which is usually after the second meeting for me. The point is to get their trust and be trust worthy and true to your word of the contract and deliver on time and you will have a client way past the one deal which is my goal.

I have a client that started with a network install. We talked and it led to a website rewrite now I write most if not all of her company software and interfaces to the web for her mortgage broker business.

I thought it would be good when I first started out to give people their monies worth and a little bit more and they will give me return business. That one $300.00 network install gave me over 60k of income in the following 2 yrs. Not to mention the 100k plus and counting revenue this one client has referred me to within her business circle. I routinely go over to her place to see if there is anything I can do for her to make her business run more smoothly. If it takes less than a week, I offer to do it for free but she wants no part of it she has to pay me for it which is good.

These are the clients I strive to keep and please to no end within reason of course.


The treatment of every client is of the utmost importance for me. I have let members of my team go to the unemployment line for any lack of respect towards a client. I do not tolerate any what so ever lack of respect for current or future clients no matter what the situation. I truly have a ZERO tolerence when it comes to respect for clients.

We are the pro's my staff must act accordingly or they will be unemployed plain and simple.

I'm a hard *** to work with/for but it's my name on the contract so I feel I have the right. If my employees feel different I don't want nor do I need them.

The client is always right in what they want, we have to come to an understanding of what they need, the budget will come out when they trust us.


Come in buzzed fine (show the creative side of the buzz) show a "little" lack of respect for a client and you will go to the unemployment line, phone conversations are taped for this reason.

This is my longest rant/post so I must end this now.



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