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#1 siXcrookedhighways

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 08:23 PM

just a friendly reminder to update your copyright notice. keeping this up to date shows visitors you are current and on the ball, plus you don't want your copy ripped off. check out the U.S. Copyright Office for info. the Copyright Basics link under About Copyright should get you started.

Example: © 2006 John Doe

... and i must confess i have not yet updated mine :embarrassed:

Edited by siXcrookedhighways, 01 January 2006 - 08:42 PM.


#2 Ron Carnell

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 09:19 PM

Careful.

The effective date of copyright is the date of creation. If that was in 2003, you probably don't want to surrender your rights for three years by changing the notice to 2006 (not that you would, but you could certainly make it a lot more difficult to enforce).

When you see an extended copyright notice on a work, such as © 2003-2006, it means that parts of the work were created (and thus copyrighted) in 2003, and other parts were created in subsequent years. Until you actually add something to your site in 2006, there's no legal need to change your copyright notice.

However, while the legal need doesn't exist, I agree it does help show visitors the site is still alive and active. Just remember to add to existing copyright, not replace it. :)

#3 randfish

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 09:21 PM

Thanks for the reminder - I need to get on that :)

#4 sonjay

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 09:25 PM

If you place the copyright notice using PHP (or other scripting language of your choice) you can have it automagically update itself every year.

Upon the stroke of midnight, all of the sites I'm responsible for suddenly changed from, e.g., Copyright 2002-2005 to Copyright 2002-2006, with no intervention on my part.

#5 siXcrookedhighways

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 10:00 PM

great points ron and i like the option of spanning the years 2002 - 2006. sonjay has a great suggestion with using your favorite scripting language to display the year. after i did updates last year i knocked myself over the heading asking why i didn't do that. it's on my list for this week.

#6 Tim

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 11:59 PM

I often forget to do this - but I remembered this year at about 4.30am on New Years Day :)

#7 travis

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Posted 02 January 2006 - 01:23 AM

Mate,

In Australia, you're protected regardless.

You designed it. You made it. You own it.

Unless otherwise specified, the original copyright belongs to you unless you have signed a document saying otherwise.

You dont even have to write the word copyright on your work.

#8 bragadocchio

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Posted 02 January 2006 - 02:03 AM

You don't have to write the word copyright on your work in the US either.

But, putting the notice on the pages of a site isn't a bad thing to do, anyway.

Here's a statement from the US Copyright Office that explains a couple of reasons why you might want to include a copyright notice in some instances:

Use of the notice may be important because it informs the public that the work is protected by copyright, identifies the copyright owner, and shows the year of first publication. Furthermore, in the event that a work is infringed, if a proper notice of copyright appears on the published copy or copies to which a defendant in a copyright infringement suit had access, then no weight shall be given to such a defendant's interposition of a defense based on innocent infringement in mitigation of actual or statutory damages, except as provided in section 504©(2) of the copyright law. Innocent infringement occurs when the infringer did not realize that the work was protected.



#9 kensplace

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Posted 02 January 2006 - 03:32 AM

Hi bill,

For people like me who are clueless on finding out about techy things about the law,
what does

except as provided in section 504©(2) of the copyright law

mean

#10 bragadocchio

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Posted 02 January 2006 - 04:25 AM

Hi Ken,

Here's a link to that section of the law:

http://www.copyright...2chap5.html#504

It deals with the types of damages that a person might claim and possibly receive under a copyright infringement lawsuit.

There can be actual damages, such as losses of profits. There can also be damages from what the infringer gained in profits.

Alternatively, there could be statutory damages imposed under certain conditions.

#11 kensplace

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Posted 02 January 2006 - 06:09 AM

Im celebrating after a hard days work doing my g/f's forums, so a little tipsy, but after a skim (and I mean, I randomly scrolled down, and started reading) this hit me in the face..

© Fraudulent Copyright Notice. - Any person who, with fraudulent intent, places on any article a notice of copyright or words of the same purport that such person knows to be false, or who, with fraudulent intent, publicly distributes or imports for public distribution any article bearing such notice or words that such person knows to be false, shall be fined not more than $2,500.

(d) Fraudulent Removal of Copyright Notice. - Any person who, with fraudulent intent, removes or alters any notice of copyright appearing on a copy of a copyrighted work shall be fined not more than $2,500.

(e) False Representation. - Any person who knowingly makes a false representation of a material fact in the application for copyright registration provided for by section 409, or in any written statement filed in connection with the application, shall be fined not more than $2,500.



Am I missing something here? Or does that say, in the US, you can basically screw someone over, and the max you have to pay is 2500 dollars, which lets face it is a lot less than what a lot of copyrighted material is worth.

Like I say, I have not fully read it, but that hit me.

#12 manager

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Posted 02 January 2006 - 10:05 AM

Hi

keeping this up to date shows visitors you are current and on the ball,

Leaving aside the legal points, I agree that it does make you look “more on the ball”.

It is also an opportunity to make some money by updating your client’s websites. I charge a minimum “1 hour labour charge” for anything I do, so it’s a nice little “earner”. :)


TreV

Edited by manager, 02 January 2006 - 10:05 AM.


#13 john928

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Posted 09 February 2006 - 06:08 PM

I have not updated mine on some of my sites yet. But most of my sites I don't even bother updating it as I use a script snippet which I made so that it automatically does it for me.

I prefer to make my sites as automated as possible, even when it comes to the copywrite part of the site.

#14 kensplace

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Posted 09 February 2006 - 06:47 PM

What is the legal situation if you based that on the server time? What if the battery died, and the time went back 199x?

If your copyright stated the wrong year due to a hardware problem, and someone copied you, would they have a claim that you stated copyright (wrong year)?

#15 Le Ier

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 03:39 PM

In most countries (in fact just about everywhere) you automatically have Copyright the moment you create something - even text for the web - music.... whatever.

But, the big problem is proving you created that at a certain moment in time- that's the tricky bit!! Yes it is in your computer - but dates and data can be changed and a 'copyright' notice does not prove when the work first existed.

My point is - you create something. Someone steals it (or part of it). You say it is yours and you wrote it in 2003. They say it's theirs and they wrote it in 2002. The point is PROVE IT.

I've run into this problem more then once and have searched the web for the answer. Yes you do have the Copyright office in the USA - but I don't live in the USA - and if I did they would be too expensive ($30 a pop....meaning everything has to be registered separately).

If you want to register all the data/text ..... whatever on your web site it will cost a small fortune. I found intellectual property registration - here I can register all the data I need in one go - put all you need into one folder - zip it - and register it within a couple of minutes.

It will hold up in court in the USA, UK even Aussi land, and takes the hassle out of IP rights.

Edited by Le Ier, 03 March 2006 - 03:41 PM.


#16 Respree

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 04:38 PM

One way to 'prove' who 'got their first' is to print out your website (where practical), then mail it to yourself. The independent post mark date is your proof that the site (text, images, etc.) existed as of a certain time.

Of course, don't open it until you have to. :)

Edited by Respree, 03 March 2006 - 04:38 PM.


#17 Le Ier

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 05:01 PM

One way to 'prove' who 'got their first' is to print out your website (where practical), then mail it to yourself.  The independent post mark date is your proof that the site (text, images, etc.) existed as of a certain time.

Of course, don't open it until you have to. :)

View Post



Yes - also known as a 'poor mans copyright' and has little chance of standing up in court these days. Legal experts in the USA and UK strongly advise not to do this.

This is what I found on the web:
1)The poor man’s copyright can be faked, in several ways – easily

2)The poor man's copyright has rarely been heralded as a success anywhere that we can find online

3)A poor man’s copyright is not technically needed to secure a copyright.

4)A poor-mans copyright could leave you even poorer, if that’s all you have as proof of copyright.
This info was found at: http://www.copyright...-mans-copyright

I'll stick to a more modern version (www.file-reg.com) that will hold up in a court of law in 2006, and not something that dates back to the 19th century. The poor mans copyright also costs more time then sitting behind your computer and registering it online. You have to buy stamps, envelopes, paper..... print it all out, seal the envelope, post it....... and it may get lost in the post!!!

Now all I have to do is activate the registration software, find the file I want to register on the computer - and click the button! Within seconds I get an email confirming my registration. With the Copyright office I have to wait 3 to 6 months! (Really)

One other point..... regarding number 3 .A poor man’s copyright is not technically needed to secure a copyright.
The same goes for electronic registration..... you already have copyright - the point is ''prove it'.

Edited by Le Ier, 03 March 2006 - 05:09 PM.


#18 bragadocchio

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 05:19 PM

If you want to register all the data/text ..... whatever on your web site it will cost a small fortune. I found intellectual property registration - here I can register all the data I need in one go - put all you need into one folder - zip it - and register it within a couple of minutes.


Really rather actually file with the offices that are official than some proxy.

Why not just register with the US Copyright Office?

http://www.copyright...r/literary.html

Or the information from WIPO:

http://www.wipo.int/.../copyright.html

#19 Le Ier

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 05:34 PM

Really rather actually file with the offices that are official than some proxy.

Why not just register with the US Copyright Office?

http://www.copyright...r/literary.html

Or the information from WIPO:

http://www.wipo.int/.../copyright.html

View Post


US Copyright office is VERY expensive. Here's a comparison:
20 songs (must be registered seperatly) @ $30 = $600 (Copyright office)
20 songs (can be registered in one zip file @ $25 (membership fee) + $18 registration fee = $43. (File-Reg.com)

No contest.

The system of 'electronic evidence' for data/files using digital signatures and digital fingerprinting has been in use since 1998 and there has never been a court case that has disaproved this method. It may be proxy - but it's cheaper, easier and does not diminish the 'legality' of evidence or proof of Copyright.

Edited by Le Ier, 03 March 2006 - 05:34 PM.


#20 Ron Carnell

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Posted 03 March 2006 - 06:00 PM

20 songs (must be registered seperatly)

That's simply not true, as someone familiar with copyrights should already know, Brian.

I have to agree strongly with Bill here. Even if we accept the efficacy of what I see as just another Poor Man's Copyright scheme, registering with a company or individual is a waste of money if that company or individual is no longer around when you need them. While I'm not suggesting that you'll be out of business next month, Brian, neither would I want to bet my future that you'll be here the rest of my natural life, plus 70 years (which is how long my copyrights last). To be frank, that skepticism is particularly well founded, I think, when you come into a forum and say "I found Intellectual Property Registration" as if you would have people think you have no vested interest. It doesn't strike me as the best way to engender trust.

#21 TheManBehindTheCurtain

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 04:09 PM

To extend this line of pragmatic thinking out further. In a long-ago small business class, I was particularly struck by one statement the teacher made when she became exasperated at the endless questions about lawsuits, liability insurance, intellectual property protection, ad nauseum. "Look," she said, "I'm a lawyer and I'd love nothing better than you scare you into believing you need me. But I've been in this business 20 years and I can tell you one thing for sure. You're not going to go out of business because someone sues you. You're going to go out of business because you don't make money." Her point being that people obsess far too much about issues they can't control, and all the press about lawsuits distort the reality that they are still very very rare. Take out some liability insurance, though in the vast majority of cases you'll never need it. Spend your time working your business.

On the point of copyright protection. Sure, go ahead and put the copyright notice on everything. Keep it up to date. But unless you are managing a large corporate site, and the company's primary asset is its web site text, you will never see any benefit from doing more than this. For small web site owners, it will be highly unlikely that you would ever want to marshal the resources necessary to hunt down plagiarists, mount a law suit, take them to court, and get any sort of judgment. What most of us would do is write a letter and try to scare them off. Sad but true. You could have all these additional time-consuming and potentially expensive resources behind you, and you'd still be spending far more time and far more money than it's worth to bring someone to court and get a judgment. With little or no potential for any compensation beyond feeling good about winning.

I'm not saying that stealing is OK, that you shouldn't be offended and pi$$ed off by it. That you shouldn't try to contact the plagiarist and try to get them to stop. What I am saying is that unless there are big-money stakes in the content, you'll just have to accept that there's no return on investment in trying to stop every petty thief, just as supermarkets know they can't stop shoplifting. Put in a few reasonable controls, and go about your business. You're smarter and more innovative than the plagiarists, and you'll just have to outmaneuver them, not out lawyer them.

#22 DianeV

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 06:46 PM

Hear, hear.

As someone who has found parts of my website and sometimes the whole site copied on a fairly continual basis, I've taken various steps to get site owners to drop it.

I don't worry over it on a continual basis, however, because I know I have something at my ready disposal that they don't have: I am not lazy, and can write just like myself.

Edited by DianeV, 05 March 2006 - 06:46 PM.


#23 trendybox

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Posted 17 March 2006 - 09:05 AM

just a side note about a copyright issue i encountered. Your name can't be copyrighted... it can be a trademark if you're a business but otherwise its fair game.
the story: I use the screen name The Limping Toad for personal things and yahoo etc. It was very original and i've been using it for... 12-13 years (yes back when i dialed into local bbs's with my 386) which is a really long time to have had the same alias. I searched google for "the limping toad" once and found some lame online game called "meridian 54" or something stupid like that. they have a location in the game called "the limping toad's tavern and inn". As to try and keep it so people who played the game wouldn't think that i stole my name from it, I checked the copyright date on the game and it was originally produced a few years after i created my name. I tried to get them to cease use of my name but as copyright law states, my name is not copyrightable material. the only way to get around this is to start selling stuff as "the limping toad" and then pay to have it trademarked.
-[sigh]-

#24 tommr

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 05:04 PM

Here is a PHP snippet I use to post the copyright date.

<? echo date("Y"); ?>

The copyright symbol is expressed as &copy; and the spaces are expressed as &nbsp;

Then if I am linking it to a seperate page that explaines our copyrithe policy it looks like this

<a href="http://www.mysite.co.../copyright.htm" title="copyright" class="nav" rel="nofollow">Copyright&nbsp;&copy;&nbsp;<? echo date("Y"); ?></a>

This way I do not have to worry about updating all those dates at the bottom of the page.

PHP needs to be turned on for this to work. I had to contact my hosting company and they gave me a bit fo code to put in my .htaccess file to make it work.

#25 iamlost

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 05:30 PM

Haven't read back through this thread so may be repeating - however...

If a page was published (uploaded to the web) in 2002 and nothing has been changed since then the copyright should be [ Copyright © 2002 ]
... if you 'update' that copyright yearly so that now it reads [ Copyright © 2011 ] you just obliterated one 'proof' of earlier creation, of actual creation date.

If a page has been changed, modified in the interim then the dates for changes may be added as in [ Copyright © 2002, 2006, 2010 ]

If the content is dynamic or may be modified frequently (as with Cre8asiteforums) then a start and inclusive to present is common practice [ Copyright © 2002 - 2011 ]

To be technical a copyright notice is not required, just as adding appropriate meta tags in the header are not. But every little bit of 'proof' can help re- DMCA or court proceeding.

See also Debra Mastaler Makes Lemonade, iamlost eats the lemons raw

#26 tommr

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 05:53 PM

Good points

#27 Michael_Martinez

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 06:09 PM

I wouldn't nofollow a copyright page. That's throwing away a LOT of PageRank (assuming all the pages on the site link to the copyright page). It's better to let the PageRank flow through the page and back out to the rest of the site.

#28 tommr

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 06:40 PM

I nofollow the page because it does not have content of value.
Is that wrong? Maybe this is sub-topic should be re-stated

#29 Michael_Martinez

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Posted 23 February 2011 - 01:47 PM

Okay, see my reply in the thread titled Linking To Incidental Pages Like Copyright, About Us, Etc..



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