10 replies to this topic

[itswillist]

I'm trying to make my site appeal more to the Google and Yahoo bots (like everyone) Do the bots put more emphasis on the image name or the description of the images ? As far as ranking is concerned ??? Any help would help .. Thanks - [URL removed by moderator]

Edited by Respree, 27 January 2007 - 02:44 PM.

[Wit]

What exactly do you mean with Image Name and Image Description?

Maybe you should post a snippet of html code (within [code] ... [/code] tags) as illustration.....

[itswillist]

Say you have a picture of an airplane your posting on your site ... Your trying to get ranked under the phrase "airplanes for sale" should you name the picture "Airplanes for sale 1" or name it whatever and have "airplanes for sale" in the description of the image on the website ?

[AbleReach]

Say you have a picture of an airplane your posting on your site ... Your trying to get ranked under the phrase "airplanes for sale" should you name the picture "Airplanes for sale 1" or name it whatever and have "airplanes for sale" in the description of the image on the website

Only if the image could reasonably be titled "airplanes for sale." If it can, go for it. If it can't, don't put energy into trying to convince search engines that it does. If it can't, do you need an image that has a strong identity as "airplanes for sale," to help focus the page?

Build what does connect to "airplanes for sale."

You might have "piper cub for sale," "airplane sale," or any number of potential places for building a real and focused identity.

Never do things for search engines that would not make sense to humans. Aim for satisfying both with the same material.

[bragadocchio]

Images can be hard for search engines, but there are some things that you can try to do.

When you choose a file name for a picture, you can use hyphens in it, such as:

delaware-coast.jpg

With the alt attribute for the image, I think that focusing upon providing visual alternative text in the spirit of what the alt attribute is about isn't a bad idea. For instance:

<img src="http://www.example.com/images/delaware-coast.jpg" alt="View of the Delaware Coast near Dewey Beach, showing the boardwalk" height="300" width="500">

I try to take another step with some images, using captions for them. I try to keep those captions and the images together in some type of container that shows the search engine that they are related, and that might put some whitespace around the picture and caption:

Some links to pages that describe slightly different ways to do that, and present those in different ways:

Image captions on Web pages (HTML and CSS techniques)

Floatutorial (See Tutorial number 2)

There's some argument over the best way to add a caption to an image, and float the image within some text using CSS. A great blog thread that covers a lot of these issues is this one:

SimpleQuiz › Part XI › Image Floating

Regardless of which one you use, there may just be a benefit to segregating the image and caption from the rest of the text on a page with a little whitespace, from an SEO perspective. It may give that caption some added weight when a search engine tries to decide how to index an image.

[bragadocchio]

Regardless of which one you use, there may just be a benefit to segregating the image and caption from the rest of the text on a page with a little whitespace, from an SEO perspective. It may give that caption some added weight when a search engine tries to decide how to index an image.

I base this statement on

Document segmentation based on visual gaps

Here's some text from that document that describes how a visual gap segmenting an image and caption from the rest of text might help determine relevance:

[0047] Although the segmentation process described with reference to FIGS. 4-7 was described as segmenting a document based on geographic signals that correspond to business listings, the general hierarchical segmentation technique could more generally be applied to any type of signal in a document. For example, instead of using geographic signals that correspond to business listings, images in a document may be used (image signals). The segmentation process may then be applied to help determine what text is relevant to what image.

[Halfdeck]

I try to take another step with some images, using captions for them. I try to keep those captions and the images together in some type of container that shows the search engine that they are related, and that might put some whitespace around the picture and caption:

I agree.

Google seems to like text that's within 7 - 10 words radius above and below an IMG element in the source code. Any text outside of that radius (besides text in H elements, though the H should be in the same "container" as the image) are ignored.

For example, on this page:

http://quest.nasa.gov/aero/background/

which ranks first for "airplanes"

http://images.google...amp;btnG=Search

You got:

were the good and bad features of the airplanes and what needs to be improved. 
		Many times, experimental concept airplanes are quite unique-looking because 
		they are trying out a strange, new concept or technological advance. Most 
		experimental planes, like the X-36 and X-29 pictured here have names starting 
		[b]with "X" as in eXperimental.</span></p>
	  <h4><a name="military"></a>Fighter/Military Airplanes</h4>[/b]
	  <p><a href="images/F-15_big.jpg"><img src="images/F-15_small.jpg"

alt="F-15" align="right" hspace="4" vspace="4" width="75"

height="46"></a><a href="images/F-16_big.jpg"><img

src="images/F-16_small.jpg" alt="F-16" align="right" hspace="4"

vspace="4" width="72" height="46"></a><span class="body">There are many different 
		kinds of military airplanes. Transport airplanes carry armies, equipment, 
		and supplies hundreds of miles to where they are needed. Reconnaissance, 
		or spy, airplanes fly secret missions to photograph enemy territory. Fighter 
		airplanes were used for the first time in World War I. Today, most fighters 
		have advanced computer, navigational, and weapons systems and are able

Where the IMG I'm looking at is

F-16_small.jpg

Searching for "different kinds of military airplanes", a snippet below IMG that lies within the 7~10 words radius, returns the image:

http://images.google...amp;btnG=Search

while searching for "transport airplanes", which lies outside the radius, doesn't return the image as a result:

http://images.google...amp;btnG=Search

Above the IMG element, searching "with X as in eXperimental" returns the IMG as a result:

http://images.google...amp;btnG=Search

but searching "X-29 pictured here" returns nothing:

http://images.google...amp;btnG=Search

[bragadocchio]

Very interesting analysis, halfdeck.

You've set out a nice way to explore how words around an image might influence what that image may rank for.

I'm guessing that there might be other factors, and even that there's a possibility of different amounts of words in a radius for different categories or classes of images.

For instance, might a photo for a concept rather than some tangible object use a different number of words around a picture. I don't know.

Regardless, it's nice to see that the words around a picture may be relevant to how it ranks. It's a good practice regardless of search engines.

[yannis]

One thing I have noticed that affects google image results is also image size. A number of users will search for larger size images and there is normally less competition (especially with older websites which used a lot of thumbnails). Try incorporating larger images it can only help.

How about title? This I also guess should have a small additional benefit.

Yannis

[egain]

I pitched against a client recently, who advise the client that renaming all his images with more applicable names (as this post suggests) would significantly improve his visibility.

Personally, from a Google Images search perspective, I can wholeheartedly see the point, however, the effect within the main SERPs imo opinion would be negligable (not saying none just fairly small).

Completely agree with Bill/Yannis btw

[Sush]

I will prefer to use alt attribute for the images.

itswillist, it's very important to know that what your visitors are searching for. Provide them the relevant information. In course of time they will become your customer. For a while forget about search engine optimization. Think about your customers and do the requisite. Then build up a balanced site for all including search engine.