17 replies to this topic

[saschaeh]

I recently outsourced a PPC campaign to someone. I implemented a bunch of Google tracking he requested. I would like to have access to these stats. He however has multiple campaigns in his CP so i understand why he would not want me to access his CP. He said he would send me a daily email report.

I would like to have access. Is there anyway i can access the same stats in my own CP or without me Interfering/seeing all his other campaigns?

Tx - Sascha

Edited by saschaeh, 31 July 2007 - 09:47 AM.

[bwelford]

Sasha, if they're using Google Adwords, then there should be no problem in your accessing directly the Google Adwords account for your website. If s/he is running a 'stable' of such Adword accounts, which s/he manages through his CP, that shouldn't block your access to your individual account.

[Dave Davis]

I agree. If he is using AdWords to manage multiple accounts, he SHOULD be using "My Client Center" (MCC)

http://adwords.googl...amp;answer=7725

This really surprises me. He is "managing" your account but wont give you access. This is unacceptable. Demand he use MCC or manages your account separately.

If he is managing your campaigns AND other campaigns in a single account, this can negatively effect your quality score should the other campaigns be performing poorly.

[saschaeh]

Thanks Dave Since then i have full access to the Stats. The one argument in favor of not giving client Google stats access is it does reveal all your carefully selected keywords.

Google stats makes it pretty easy for the client to find out what the selected keyword are which is not ideal for ppc manager should the client decided to ditch the ppc manager as s/he could then use all your carefully selected keywords and go do it themselves or get another guy to do it.

Edited by saschaeh, 11 November 2007 - 02:23 AM.

[Dave Davis]

Your approach and relationship still confuse me. You should be working WITH your PPC manager. They are being paid to perform a service and the data SHOULD be your IP.

Does your estate agent hide their advertising methods from you in case you want to rent your apartment yourself?

[saschaeh]

If the real estae agent where to think of some special way to advertise your property which was highly successful which is not necessary common knowledge i dont think they will be to happy to give out that information at will. After all there are many real estate agents that would love to use those methods and undercut you.

I do agree with you and like i said i have full access to the stats and we chat almost everyday about the campaign and where we need to tweak the keywords landing pages etc...

The argument is: To give full access to google stats is to give full access to keyword selection. And keyword selection is a large part of the skill of being a PPC Marketer, no? Yes you select the initial sets with client and have meeting around that but the full list of variation within those keywords, the researched list of keywords that related which people infact search for more then the client may first assume, is all part of being a good PPC Marketer. So to give out that whole list puts the PPC manager in a vulnerable position. That is argument of not giving full access to google stats and rather sending out reports which dont reveal your keywords.

I also manage some campaigns for clients and it does also depended on the client. I am fairly clued up so i will want full access and so i do have it. Many clients dont want full access becasue they dont understand and couldnt be asked to check the stats as they see this as your job.

So i guess it also depends on the situations but to get back on topic i dont think the argument of not giving out full stats is unreasonble primarily due to the keywords.

Edited by saschaeh, 11 November 2007 - 03:19 AM.

[saschaeh]

posted thread about this here: http://www.cre8asite...showtopic=56393

[Thejspot]

And keyword selection is a large part of the skill of being a PPC Marketer, no?

It's part of it, but it would be a concern if this is the way your PPC Marketeer viewed it. Chosing keywords isn't a big deal any more than making sure you have good, well-written ad copy, a good landing page with a strong call to action and analytics data to see how your campaign is performing.

This really surprises me. He is "managing" your account but wont give you access. This is unacceptable. Demand he use MCC or manages your account separately.

AND if he is managing your account, why do you need access? Don't you trust them? Isn't the whole point of outsourcing something that you don't have to think about it?

But, agreed. He should be using MCC, but you can also give viewing access in Analytics to another user, he doesn't have to give you access to the PPC campaign when all you want is access to the Analytics. You can also set reports to be automatically emailed to you from Analytics so I don't see why he can't set that up either.

Weird situation....

[ryan5billion]

I think I would setup an account under your name
and have him manage YOUR campaign in there.

That is how we work with some of our clients.

This way once the work is completed they can
change their pw and move on. Everyone is happy.

Of course, these other guys already pointed out
MCC - another great option.

[saschaeh]

Well since this i have full access to analitics and keywords. Although i dont have access to the adwords account.

With the MCC do you sign up each site independantly with adwords and then link them using the MCC?

If the client can view billing, which apparently s/he can, then would this not pose a problem because s/he could see what profits you are marking?

[Kim@ASM]

I use the MCC in Google. The clients have their own log-ins with their email addresses and passwords and then I link it into my MCC. So the clients can go into their accounts and look at reporting, billing, etc. But they can't see my other clients' information. That can only be seen by me in my MCC.

I think it also adds a layer of trust between me and my clients. They can go in and stop their campaigns at any time. They can take away my access. I put myself in their shoes and I would not want a PPC Manager holding all the cards. What if it's a one-man firm and something happens to the person? I think my clients like having their own log-in information and being able to fiddle with their reports if they want to look around themselves.

[Thejspot]

Kim, you must have some seriously well behaved clients.

I used to do this with customers and they would go in and change things and not tell me. You can imagine the problems this caused. They would add keywords, change adcopy and generally stuff things up.

Further, the more they saw, the more questions they had about how it all worked. I don't mind the odd chat with a client, but the "management" of their campaign became a full education in Online marketing.

My feelings on it became that when I go and have my car fixed, I don't care how they do it, I just need to know that it's done.

I guess also that if you went to most advertising agencies and gave them a budget to run an adcampaign, I don't need to know how they came up with what they did, I'm paying for the results, not the educational experience of how it was all produced.

Anyway, different things work for different people I guess.

[saschaeh]

J-Spot id be one of those clients that would drive you to drink I want access i have a million questions and i want to experiment all the time...

Would there be a point where you tell your client politely sorry if i answer any more questions ill need to charge a consultation fee or something of the like?

[iamlost]

I want access i have a million questions and i want to experiment all the time...

So watch (keeping mouth zipped and hands in pockets ) and read and learn.

Then, while leaving the pro to do the job for which he was hired, build a separate small site, open your own account and play.
If you have 'the knack' you will have added a new skill to your CV, earned a bit or three, and have increased options and opportunities. If you haven't you are out a bit or three and are somewhat the wiser.

You (saschaeh) and Autocrat are like a kitten I once had - always stuck up a tree, down the drain...

[Thejspot]

Would there be a point where you tell your client politely sorry if i answer any more questions ill need to charge a consultation fee or something of the like?

Most of the clients I end up with aren't the kind of people who would pay to ask questions. Bit it's a tough one because you don't make that much money managing an AdWords campaign for someone. You can't really charge more than about 10% management fee (you could charge a set up fee which is a really good idea). And unless you get 10% back from Google (for being an official business partner), you don't make much.

So to answer your question more specifically... I email them reading material saying something like "It's quite complicated, it might be better for me to give you something to read at your leisure"... bla bla bla.

[EGOL]

I am on the side of the service provider. I run the ad program for the agreed upon fee. If client needs lessons then that will come at an additional charge.

One of my friends is a plumber. He has a sign in his office....

RATES FOR OUR SERVICES

If we fix it for you: $50/hour
If you watch: $65/hour
If you ask questions: $80/hour
If you screwed it up before calling us: $100/hour
If our competitor screwed it up: $200/hour
If you want to supervise: $500/hour

Edited by EGOL, 06 January 2008 - 07:15 PM.

[bwelford]

That's great, Egol.

[Autocrat]

Meow.... ?

LMAO... I'm not a kitten... more like an adventurous small elephant (and just as subtle ).


It is a scenario that could translate easily to any of our professions.
If you are the visual designer... do you show the client how you do things... the software, the processes etc.?
If you are the coder, do you let them see how to tackle the design adn implement it, including notes on handling incosistencies and browser issues?
If the programmer, do you show them how you implement DB structure, input/transformation/validation/output code etc.?
If hosting, do you supply access to FTP, CPanel etc.?

So why does the poor PPC guy/gal have to show some of their magic?


On the other hand... yes, the client has a large amount of entitlement, and should have access to things that could affect them.
The danger is, unlike most of the above, alot of people will assume that it takes no real skill/effort/knowledge to do that job (I think they could be wrong!), and there is a certain type of person that will quite happily attempt to do it themselves... chopping the PPC guy/gal shortly after bbelieving they have the ability to do the job themselves.

So.... what would you do in their shoes... and what would they do in yours?
It boils down to trust and professionalism - on both parts.


I msut admit to a little confusion though... why outsource it if you do it for your own clients?