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Ah, Bing, I Wish You Had More Traffic. Really I Do!

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#1 earlpearl

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Posted 05 October 2016 - 04:35 PM

I took a call today from one of the Bing Ad "advisors".   Their goal is to get us to improve our advertising efforts on Bing.   Hey, I'm in agreement with that.   One reason is that our cpc (cost per click) on bing is abt 1/3 of the cpc on google.  Now this is for a local business and when somebody connects with us through Bing, I have to work through detail to find the form lead.   If they call b/c of finding us on Bing most often I simply won't know it.

 

I have no idea if Bing converts better or worse than does google or any other search engine. 

 

In any case we had received emails and reports from Bing suggesting they can help us improve our performance.   I never read them.

 

Why?

 

Well today following the call, but not the "in depth look" (because I was busy) I compared Bing traffic and ad costs to Google traffic and ad costs.

 

Over the last 3 months we have a total of 15 times traffic from goog than from bing.   On an ads basis we have a little less than 15 times the number of goog clicks to bing ad clicks.    Now on a cost basis for ads...We are spending abt 30 times on Goog than Bing.   (and on impressions far more impressions in goog than bing--didn't bother to compare...but its probably at a similar difference than the numbers above)

 

On a monthly basis I simply don't spend time worrying about bing ads or costs or anything.   bigger fish to fry.   While I'm spending too much time on operations and not enough time on the web, Bing just doesn't contribute to much.

 

I wish they had more traffic.  I wish people clicked our bing ads.  I have to start using bing more and google less.   But more critically than me I wish tons of people would use bing more.

 

Its all so sad.  And it helps the goog gorg get bigger and get away with more crap.  

 

Meanwhile I'll mosey over and work through some of that bing stuff.   Mostly to be "hospitable".   Such such a pity.



#2 iamlost

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Posted 05 October 2016 - 09:33 PM

I am constantly amazed (since like forever) at how little Bing traffic many/most webdevs report; and further how disparaging they tend to be.

The average across all my English language sites (targeting Australia/New Zealand, Canada/US, UK) is (and has been relatively stable at for many years) ~40% organic search traffic, of which ~55% is Google the rest being mostly Bing and Yahoo. And they convert such that their traffic value surpasses G's.

Not all search is created equal...
A little aside:
In overall UK search it is Google at ~90.5% of search, Bing ~5.5%, Yahoo ~2.5%
BUT
in transactional UK search it is Yahoo with ~34%, Bing ~33%, Google ~31%
Note: Experian non-publicly published data (late 2015).

Further, a major German based SEO/marketer has told me that for the sites he works with Bing crushes the competition in the $500+ per item market, the Middle East, and the B2B market (with some crossovers I'm guessing).

Of course every business model, site, locale, etc. is different. But Bing IS out there and can/does convert quite well. Yes, Google has over 60% of US search but Bing at ~20% and Yahoo at ~10% are still about a third of searches. A third! Yet many/most webdevs say they never see significant numbers from either.

Two fun thoughts:
* where oh where are those 1/3 of all searches ending up (no, unfortunately they aren't all coming to visit me).
* think of all those auto-SEO tools scraping Google... how great a percentage of all those Google searches are really SEO tools?

I wish I knew what makes my sites more SE diverse/equitable... I just do what I do (with 'secret sauce' as originally espoused by Ammon (Black_Knight) here at Cre8 way back when but - naturally - modified as the times they are a changing ever since) and it seems to work. Knock my wooden head it continues...

 

May Fortune smile on your endeavors.



#3 earlpearl

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Posted 06 October 2016 - 09:13 AM

I am constantly amazed (since like forever) at how little Bing traffic many/most webdevs report; and further how disparaging they tend to be.

The average across all my English language sites (targeting Australia/New Zealand, Canada/US, UK) is (and has been relatively stable at for many years) ~40% organic search traffic, of which ~55% is Google the rest being mostly Bing and Yahoo. And they convert such that their traffic value surpasses G's.

 

Different websites different results:  In the last year for our one largest local site  (a mere speck of web traffic).   Of B, Y, and G traffic G=90%.   4 years ago same website same time period and same length of time (1 year)   g=86% and B & Y  =14% total.

 

Of note, on an anecdotal basis I find those kinds of results more or less from many who reference local traffic.   (think all the doctor, dentist, tire experts sites in all the cities in North America, Europe, Australia who might comment on this type of thing.   But that is a possibly about 20-40 websites each representing something like 20-150,000 visits/year.).    

 

Not lots of traffic, in the aggregate, but the reporting shows that heavy skewing toward google on the search side.

 

 

Not all search is created equal...
A little aside:
In overall UK search it is Google at ~90.5% of search, Bing ~5.5%, Yahoo ~2.5%
BUT
in transactional UK search it is Yahoo with ~34%, Bing ~33%, Google ~31%
Note: Experian non-publicly published data (late 2015).

Further, a major German based SEO/marketer has told me that for the sites he works with Bing crushes the competition in the $500+ per item market, the Middle East, and the B2B market (with some crossovers I'm guessing).

Of course every business model, site, locale, etc. is different. But Bing IS out there and can/does convert quite well. Yes, Google has over 60% of US search but Bing at ~20% and Yahoo at ~10% are still about a third of searches. A third! Yet many/most webdevs say they never see significant numbers from either.

Two fun thoughts:
* where oh where are those 1/3 of all searches ending up (no, unfortunately they aren't all coming to visit me).
* think of all those auto-SEO tools scraping Google... how great a percentage of all those Google searches are really SEO tools?

I wish I knew what makes my sites more SE diverse/equitable... I just do what I do (with 'secret sauce' as originally espoused by Ammon (Black_Knight) here at Cre8 way back when but - naturally - modified as the times they are a changing ever since) and it seems to work. Knock my wooden head it continues...

 

May Fortune smile on your endeavors.

 

I can't comment on sales conversions.  On our sites, because they are services with varying costs and payments, most of the time we don't convert on the web with an automatic payment.  To the extent that we are doing it, its a very minimal number of transactions.   I won't bother to voice an opinion or knowledge on the topic.  I have no experience.

 

The examples you throw out are worth thought.  I'm in the student/listener/learner category.   Hey folks who can add more evidence?

 

We do know that our IOS/I phone buyers are better than Android buyers.  We know it from a wide variety of efforts, some of which I won't go into.  The IOS owners are dramatically better buyers in the grand scale. 

 

At various times in the past two years I know the Bing teams made efforts to attack google traffic and market share.  It hasn't worked.  I don't see any such public efforts now.  (of course who knows what their lobbying muck a mucks are doing in regional/state/federal and European govts to try and effect change.

 

Anyway I'll chat with the Bing ad advisors.  All the bing folks on the ad side have been extremely nice, helpful and responsive any time I've spoken with them with regard to their campaigns. 

 

In any case at least for now, I'm focusing on searching in bing for the time being...so long as I continue to pay attention.  ;)

 

 

PS:   every time in one acct (GMAIL) I have some interaction w/Bing   I get a slew of emails from adwords.   What do you think?   Are they reading my emails????    I got a feeling they are at least scanning the titles.


Edited by earlpearl, 06 October 2016 - 11:53 AM.


#4 Nny777

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Posted 11 October 2016 - 03:50 AM


PS:   every time in one acct (GMAIL) I have some interaction w/Bing   I get a slew of emails from adwords.   What do you think?   Are they reading my emails????    I got a feeling they are at least scanning the titles.

 

Gmail definitely have some idea of the content of your emails, given the advertising you get within Gmail.

 

We had a call from Big yesterday offering us a bunch of advertising credit, so we'll be giving it a go a bit more. It's just normally a problem of not wanting to put money into something that you can't be sure how it's going to work. I also assume Bing is more popular with certain demographics (like computer illiterate people, who wouldn't think to change their default SE) but haven't done much research actually. It would be great for Google to have some proper competition though!



#5 bobbb

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Posted 11 October 2016 - 09:57 AM

 

I also assume Bing is more popular with certain demographics (like computer illiterate people, who wouldn't think to change their default SE)

I must be the exception. I intentionally changed SE to BING because I can and want to. When using any G property like GA in use IE instead of FF which is my default. ... and those who can't change it use Bing to find Google then when they hit the Google site a little reminder comes up to make G their default SE. Neat eh? .... and MS got sued by the DOJ for monopolistic behaviour.

 

They do read your mail. I read it somewhere.



#6 earlpearl

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Posted 11 October 2016 - 11:33 AM

I must be the exception. I intentionally changed SE to BING because I can and want to. When using any G property like GA in use IE instead of FF which is my default. ... and those who can't change it use Bing to find Google then when they hit the Google site a little reminder comes up to make G their default SE. Neat eh? .... and MS got sued by the DOJ for monopolistic behaviour.

 

They do read your mail. I read it somewhere.

 

Hm.   I run a couple of adwords accts with a cover gmail acct.   That gmail acct also includes some bing ad accts.    Its primarily a business email acct with little extra fluff or any personal correspondence.

 

There are a good bit of informative or alert emails, most of which I never open or read.   I just scanned it.   I wouldn't say this is conclusive nor does it occur all the time, but on quite a few instances following some "pithier" email from bing about our accts, and/or where there might be some interaction I get some kind of notification from google either that day or the next day.

 

It occurs enough to have grabbed my attention.   Is it automatic?   I don't know, but I smell a goog rat. 

 

Meanwhile every time I get a google adwords questionnaire it always includes questions about our "spend" elsewhere.  Always.  Those questionnaires always include Bing.   I have to admit, I fill out that question MOST (but not all of the time).  If I were responding to a verbal questionnaire of this ilk from another advertiser I never tell them where I am spending money or with whom. 

 

Damn I'm slipping....those web questionnaires have found my weak point.   Got to catch myself on this.

 

Meanwhile they don't know, but possibly they estimate where the "spends" are.   Really astounding....the Bing spends are a crazy small fraction of the google spends.  Because of less impressions, less clicks and then generally cost per click (cpc) costs that generally are running about 1/3 less than google across the board.



#7 earlpearl

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Posted 11 October 2016 - 01:28 PM

....a wee bit of testing.   Just scheduled an ads discussion with a person from BING  on my google calendar.    I wonder if I'll get a reaction from "you know who" :rolleyes:


Edited by earlpearl, 11 October 2016 - 01:28 PM.


#8 earlpearl

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Posted 13 October 2016 - 02:42 PM

No automatic contact on the email acct from google (this time).   Meanwhile over the course of the year the goog ad acct has generated around 12 times the volume of paid clicks as has bing, and the reports on impressions is abt 12-14 times as high on goog than bing.   Its the difference in traffic volume.   How sad as bing cpc is running about 1/3 to 40% of costs.

 

The exercises are always helpful to me as I don't spend as much time scrutinizing the ad accts.  One thing that invariably seems like a waste of time to me is the focus on negative keywords.   So many of those negative keywords are one of a kind phrases.   I can't be bothered spending dozens or hundreds of hours killing one of a kind phrases when new ones pop up endlessly.  Its like whack-a-mole, and the ad machines keep telling me to spend endless time here.   I believe that is a waste of time.





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